Not interested in anything (anhedonia)

[Till23]

Hi

Does anyone have any suggestions for anhedonia?  Someone I know says they feel like this.

What I mean by that is does anyone have any suggestions to overcome the feeling of nothingness or numbness even when doing things you used to enjoy.

Or even the motivation to try things or do things. Apparently it kind of feels like a laziness but it’s a deeper feeling than that. 

[Jynx]

Ach @Till23 anhedonia is such a tricky one. I think the neuroscience is like... the regions of the brain responsible for pleasure have actually shrunk a bit, so it is a lot harder to experience pleasure because it's like those regions are out of whack from disuse. I think sometimes you almost have to 'force' the pleasure (obviously not in any way that would be unsafe or extra distressing) so that you can start 'waking' those neural pathways back up. There's some info and ideas here if you wanna take a look - establishing a routine and engaging in activities regularly seem to be recommendations! As is talk therapy, as per - does your friend have some professional support at the moment?

[Till23]

Thanks for link @Jynx 

Today when I went for a coffee and was talking with them, they said even though they used to like doing that kind of thing, currently they felt nothing about it - not bad but also not good.

Later they did something else kind of out of “duty” because they said they’d do it, but they really didn’t feel like it and didn’t enjoy it at all.

As far as I know, they have seen someone in past, but not currently. They have depression and have been on medication for a while. I thought if they did things they might feel better overall. But currently doesn’t seem to be helping 

[MJG017]

Hi @Till23 

I have a few suggestions based on what helped me when I was experiencing a very similar feeling for a period of time not so long ago.

I started out my just trying to do small things, things that didn't take very long at all, maybe even just a few minutes.  It was almost impossible for me to feel any enjoyment so by starting with these small things, it allowed me to begin to build a bit of a habit without putting pressure on myself to 'have fun'.  I also started trying things i hadn't done before.  Since i wasn't enjoying anything, doing something new gave me a bit of interest that just wasn't there for things I had enjoyed before.

Even just forcing myself to get off the couch or bed for a short time, just to get moving felt like it helped me to do other small things.  In the beginning all of these small things were things I had to make myself do, but slowly it started to become easier and I found i could do them for longer without feeling like it was an imposition.

It also helped to sit somewhere soothing.  For me it was outside looking at the ducks that would use the pool.  I figured it i was going to sit somewhere and stare into space... it might as well be somewhere nice and relaxing, and somewhere that made me feel some little happiness.

For me, i knew the major cause was depression about some major stuff going on in my life, so i started to reach out out and try to find a little bit of support in dealing with that.  It also got me more involved in supporting others which helped give me a sense of purpose which also helped a lot.

Throughout all of this it was important to remind myself that I wasn't doing it to feel happy or like I was enjoying something.  If i thought like that, then I knew I would give up because it wasn't working.  The goal was just to get myself moving and doing things.  In the hope that eventually that enjoyment would return.  I needed to remove all pressure on myself at the start so i didn't feel like i was failing.  That's not what it was about at the start... it was just about doing anything, even if for brief periods.

It takes a while to work through, but eventually i started to find i started to feel some enjoyment doing things again and i could do them for longer and longer.  The key thing though was to work on the root cause and tackle that at the same time.

Any yes, I did feel like i was being lazy, which was why I didn't talk about it.  It felt like that's all anyone would tell me.. "get off your butt and do something!"  It wasn't even a motivation issue.  It wasn't a lack of motivation, doing anything just felt pointless.  Life felt pointless.  I had no wish to end it, but it just felt like why bother doing anything.

So maybe talk to this person about what they feel is behind this feeling for them.  Remind them that anything they can do to get out of it, even something tiny like getting out of bed is a big win.  I hope this person finds a way though soon.  It's a horrible place to be in.

[Till23]

Thanks @MJG017 

I shall relay your suggestions. I have also felt a bit like this at times but not as much as my friend currently seems to be.

[Jynx]

@Till23 ach... the sense of duty/obligation can be soooo tricky!! I reckon for me it's cos my brain will throw me stuff like "But if I don't do x then they will feel so crappy! I don't want them to feel crappy!" and like... since it sounds very much like a noble pursuit/kind-hearted thing to do, it feels like if I don't follow through it will mean I'm a bad person.

Took me a long time to realise a) that not only is it completely ignoring my own needs, and in fact would likely result in the person telling me not to bother if they knew that I was so solidly ignoring my own needs, b) it's actually kinda presumptive of my brain to believe that the person will definitely end up feeling crappy, and also kinda presumptive to believe that their emotional response would be solely my fault if that did end up happening. 

Learning to recognise my own needs was also a big part of that, do you reckon that's something your friend is struggling with too? 

I also really wanna echo @MJG017's words (fantastic post btw friend, ty for sharing your experiences, genuinely learned from it my own self) around that self-inflicted pressure 'to have fun'. Shame is one of those nasty little self-perpetuating things, whereby feeling ashamed of not 'accomplishing enjoyment' creates more stress, which then makes it that much harder to pull away from the apathy all over again. I also really like what you said about the benefits of routine and consistency. A goal of 'doing art every day' or 'playing soccer once a week' is a LOT more achievable than 'experience joy again' or 'find pleasure in my passions' - because they're so intangible and abstract!! Very easy recipe for shame spirals hey. 

Ach I've gone rambling again! Hope there's some helpful kernels in here 😉

[Till23]

Yes @Jynx and @MJG017 there are some kernels in there.

 I always feel obligated to do things if I’ve said I would. I have got slightly better at this of late, but still

a problem and I think for my friend as well. So yes, trying to treat yourself as you are treating the person/people you are feeling a duty too is a good point.

I don’t know if my friend feels pressure to have fun, but maybe they do. I think they just want to feel something.

They are, as am I, trying to have a routine of doing things which will improve when more things go back as we move away from this holiday period. I will try to gently encourage them to keep going with routine.

So thank you both

[Jynx]

Any time @Till23 and all the best for you both in your recovery journeys!! 💜